Courteeners are an indie-rock band from the United Kingdom (UK). They have smashed records in the UK with their debut album St. Jude becoming the album with the longest gap between its release and becoming number one on the UK charts; it went to number 4 in 2008 (the year of release), and to number 1 in 2023 (its 15th anniversary). The band are doing their debut tour in Australia in March 2025. Here, Ellie Robertson (ER) talks to the lead singer of the Courteeners Liam Fray (LF) about music through the generations, starting out small, and perspectives on writing.
ER: Hey, thank you so much for having me (yadda yadda). You guys have been around since 2006, with your first album being released in 2008. I was born in 2003, grew up in Scotland, and the Courteeners were a staple of mine and all my friends’ playlists throughout our teenage years straight through into our twenties now. I think that’s just incredible. Did you ever think, in the early days of releasing music, that you would become such an integral part of the UK indie-rock culture? And through generations too?
LF: No, not at all, you know. Not at all. It’s so nice that you say that. Scotland has such a massive part of our story, very early gigs we’ve done at ABC, King Talks, the Barrowlands [famous Scottish pubs]. We were really welcomed with open arms by Scotland, so they made it easy for us to play.
In terms of being part of it, I think because I was such a fan of bands growing up. It was like people mentioned all the Manchester stuff, but I was a fan of the Americas, Interpols, Years and Years, and Walkland. Obviously the Strokes and the White Stripes, and I’d be reading NME. I worked at a shop on Wednesday with my mark because that’s when it came out and I’d buy the magazine. I’d devour it from cover to cover. I thought we might release a couple of singles, so when we got up with a deal and an album, we just had never thought about it. It was as if each next thing came, there was no grand plan.
We were all just friends from school and from a really young age. It’s never like, you know, we didn’t go to music college and we didn’t have any grand plans. It was just like getting in my garage and seeing what happened. It was the most stereotypical, organic friends in a garage you can imagine. So to be here nearly twenty years later is, well… it’s a bit of a miracle, and it’s also a bit of a blessing.
ER: It’s a crazy story, honestly. I was looking into the story of the band, and being friends since ten years old is a crazy long time to stay friends.
LF: Michael, the drummer, his family lived next to some of my family, so we’ve been friends in school since four or five [years old]. It’s a long time. And you go with each other like family. The band is almost secondary to our friendship. The songs are really important to us, but if the band was off tomorrow, we’d still be hanging around. Not that it will, but you know.
ER: If we’re talking a bit about your love of bands and everything as well, I kind of see UK indie-rock as a very distinct style of indie. It’s very different and identifiable as quite separate to the style of indie in Australia or the US. How did it feel to realise that you were able to reach such a broad audience overseas as well, whilst having that niche? Did you ever see this becoming a reality?
LF: Again, no, not at all. And I take real joy in that we only very, very recently – on this record, really – have been on the radio. We’ve been on [the radio], but not mainstream radio, we’ve had a bit of backing here and there, but compared to some of our peers, we weren’t backed as much as they were. We’ve done well in the UK, but overseas, if we did 200 tickets in Munich, I’d have been like “200 people have seen us in Munich? That’s amazing”. It’s never been like “we need to be doing arenas”or “we should be doing these big outdoor shows”.
There was never any of that. That’s the dream, isn’t it? Pack your bag, get on a plane, go and hang out with some other people, see some of the world. When I say that’s the dream, I mean that’s the dream of a ten year old boy, not necessarily someone who’s in a band, because you still don’t think it’s going to happen.
You’re in the band, and you play, and you’re not thinking, “we’ll go to Australia next year. We’ll go to America next year.” I write quite everyday stuff, but I suppose also, by turn, that means it kind of appeals to everybody as well. It’s quite lucky for me because, I wouldn’t say it’s selfish, but I don’t have to think too hard about writing because… it’s just me, I guess.
I think people really identify with that as well. That’s the kind of book that I like reading, [books by] lyricists like Shannon Bonett and Laura Marling. They were able to write about themselves, but it takes you somewhere else.
ER: I guess that also feeds into that intergenerational thing as well, especially growing up in the UK. The culture is the same as my Mum and Dad’s, like it stays that way throughout the ages. I think, particularly where I was from, we have a similar culture to Manchester as well.
LF: There’s so much in music where you’re passing it down as well. Whether it be your parents listening to it, or my older sister, like she would pass me her CDs and records, and that’s a real connector. Some people have it in sport, where your old man will take you to the football or whatever.
For me, it was always music. My mum would give me Motown records and Beatles records. I’ve got nieces and nephews now that I might get to listen to The Strokes or the DMA’s. But I’ll be passing on the stuff that I’m into.
That’s a real love thing. If I love someone like that to share it, that’s what it’s about. It’s sharing the memories.
ER: Yeah, 100 percent. In terms of top influences in music, do any of them come from Australia? Are there any bands from Australia that you love? I know recently you did a collaboration with the DMAs, who are also really great!
LF: Yeah, obviously love the DMAs, and love Tame Impala. I’ve been banging to that. It’s absolutely class, man. Do you know what, I can’t wait to see what the crowds are like and stuff. Again, we come in, anywhere we go, it’s always new. You’re nervous that you have to win people over, but I’m pretty sure we’ll be on the same wavelength on things. It doesn’t feel like we’re coming at it from a place of like “these guys are weird”. I think people are gonna be accepting of what we bring.
ER: Oh, absolutely. Aussies are quite chill, they’re good. So, is this your first time in Australia or the first trip [to Australia] in a long time?
LF: Yeah, first one ever! I’ve never been, so it’s my first time in Australia. It’s really exciting. I’ve got some family in Sydney and Melbourne, so going through the guest list, I think.
ER: Absolutely, dotting around! Gorgeous. What are you most excited about coming over here?
LF: I think when we were younger we’d get stuck into nightlife. I think now that I’m a bit older, I wanna get up and see the sun. Get up, be by the ocean, get on a bike and just see as much as I can and soak it in. Kind of do nothing, while doing everything. Just fucking give me the sun, give me the ocean!
Obviously it’s mid-February, I’m looking out the window and it’s just grey, grey, grey. It’s been like this since October, so I’d much rather be where you are right now.
ER: If it helps, we’ve had like 40 degree heat waves recently, so it’s kind of like one extreme to the other!
LF: I would rather that! I have heard that, but hopefully it chills out a little bit. I think it’s just so nice, like with the guys, we’ve been together for so long, but we don’t see each other loads outside of the band. We’ve just done a tour, and when you finish the tour you have a few months away from each other. It was just nice for us to go away, you know? I remember dragging our amps up the Night and Day, which was our old rehearsal room 20 years ago… and now we’ll be standing at the Sydney Opera House.
It would be really special, I think, to share those memories with each other, because the other thing is when you’re in a band, you’re on this kind of treadmill. You have to take stock and appreciate where you are, so I can’t wait. It’s less than two weeks, it’s so crazy.
ER: It’ll be crazy. It’s a cool experience, for sure. I can’t imagine how many places you’ve been able to go to and experience. It’s amazing.
LF: Yeah, well, I’m really into my food, so I’ve already had people send me hundreds of places to go. I’ve got to sift through them and stuff, but I’m a BIG foodie. Plenty of cycling, plenty of food and all the places on the hit list. Gotta sift through them all.
ER: Sounds like a pretty great plan! Now, I’m from Honi Soit, which is the student newspaper at the University of Sydney. We’re a relatively small publication, so I really appreciate you having some time for us. A lot of our audience are students who look up to bands like the Courteeners, like The Smiths, and other bands in general. I’m sure a lot of them would be influenced by the journey that you guys have taken to get where you are.
Do you have any tips that would have helped you as a small aspiring band back in the day? Or maybe even any tips in the current industry that may help them?
LF: Yes. The first thing a singer has to do is really, really look after their voice. That’s an actual product 101. No one said that to me early doors, and I think people want me to say “oh, get a good manager” or “keep a good circle of friends”. Well, everyone’s got good friends and so on. Getting a good manager can be good, it can be tough, but you have to trust your gut.
Looking after your voice is absolutely number one. When you’re touring, even when you’re doing small shows, you can be belted out. It sounds really boring, but I wish someone would have said it to me. You have to warm up properly, and you have to warm down.
It’s just so not rock and roll, but I spent those early years in agony in my throat. Everyone’s smoking and shit, and it’s just gruelling. You have to be physically fit to talk. I think people think you can just get away with it, and you just can’t. We definitely had that realisation after a few years that you’ve got to look after yourself to have a good time.
I think it’s really exciting now because you don’t have to spend loads of money. Like suddenly you’ve got a laptop and a keyboard and you can write. I think nothing’s off the table. If you’re really struggling for ideas, copy people. Copy stuff, because you start copying them and your own ideas come off the back of that. You know, if I lined up St. Jude [their debut album] being, like, twelve songs, I could probably tell you each one of them might carry, or almost stem from, others. Every single thing you’ve done starts with “oh, that’s a Simon and Garfunkel thing” or “that’s definitely a Laura Marley when she goes from the C to the G”. You know, little tiny things. I guess, not to copy from other people, but learn their songs.
This is cheesy, but put the hours in. I enjoy it, but if you’re not enjoying it, put it away for a bit.
ER: Putting in the hours is something that has become so uncommon. I feel like it also ties in with having everything at hand. Everything’s really instantaneous all the time now, but music is a form of art and it takes so much time to perfect. If you don’t put in the time, then it’s just not going to be great.
LF: A hundred percent. I saw something on Instagram the other day, so I actually reposted it. It said, like, “the news is so intense, and I feel so bound up in following it that I haven’t got the time to read a book or sit at the piano”.
And I was like, “well, hang on a minute. That should be number one. Get those books open, sit at the piano, lose yourself”. And that’s the thing, like that’s how I get work done at my house. The lid is on the piano, and it’s only been a week, and I miss it already. To not come down in the morning and spend twenty minutes playing when you’re there. You’re not thinking about putting the bins out, you’re not thinking about everything. You’re just transported somewhere magic by those [piano] keys.
I think if you’ve got a slight inclination that you might like to do it, give it a go. Something magic might happen.
ER: That kind of leads into my next question. The Courteeners, you guys have put out an album every two to four years since your debut album, which is an insane amount of work. What keeps you in the game and motivated to keep creating very well-received and well-thought out bodies of work?
LF: Oh, I appreciate that! Thank you for that, first of all. I still don’t think that this is what I do. It’s still not like “okay, gotta get another record” or “got to go on this tour”. This is mad, but I kind of just float through. It might have been Paul Weller, but [the idea that] the songs just float by and you’ve got to grab them. Like, it might be six months and there’s no grabbing, then all of a sudden, you get three or four in a short space of time. When that happens, it’s like “okay, maybe this is a body of work”.
Maybe because I’ve got such good friendships with the guys, you feel like a duty to them, almost to like, not keep it going, because that sounds like we’re bored and we’re not. But I don’t see it as a career. It just happened. I love being in the studio. Most of the songs, even now, I write on the end of my bed with the acoustic or a piano. But when you get in the studio and those ideas get into the next step, that part of the process when it goes from your idea at home into the first conception in the studio, that is magic.
I think I’m really good at doing it for the right amount of time as well. You know, you can do it for a few days, it could not be enough. But you can be in it for six weeks, and then you’re overthinking, it’s too much. I love that when you get that right. When you take an idea in and you mess with it and you think “we had nothing two weeks ago and now we’ve got these three songs, that even if nobody else ever hears, we’ve got them here”. I’ll hear them. I’ll listen to it.
Maybe one out of every ten gets on the album, and then two or three of them get in the live set and then you see 50,000 people singing it back. And it’s loud. What the fuck? It’s pretty special. It’s not about the numbers either, because there’s just as much enjoyment. I’ve got 100 songs on my laptop that nobody will probably ever hear, but I buzz them up. So maybe that’s the collection in a few years.
ER: I just want to end this on the note that I think you have such a beautiful outlook on music. I’m not a professional, but I think that’s why you guys have become so successful and so widespread. You’re so genuine, and I really appreciate that. I guess my last question would be, have you got any last comments for the students that might be reading this?
LF: Well, what I would say is there’s only about 100 tickets left out of [around] 1200, so get a ticket. It will be pretty special to come over and share these moments. So, if no one’s got a ticket yet, there’s only about 100 left so come down!
The Courteeners will be playing live at the Metro Theatre on 5th March 2025.
